El Camino No Tomado
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evfokas в(ъв)/на 2014-09-23
ϕιλομαθής evfokas в(ъв)/на 2014-09-25| 1. | The Road Not Taken |
| 2. | Nothing Gold Can Stay |
| 3. | Stopping by Woods on a Snowy Evening |
ϕιλομαθής
вторник, 23/09/2014 - 21:43
Hello my friend, thanks again for working on this difficult translation. Here are my questions/concerns so far:
Line 3: With my Caribbean Spanish, when I hear "tendido" I instantly imagine a guy laying flat on the ground. To me, "long I stood" is closer to "me quedé parado largo rato".
What do you think of:
"Y en uno, miré en cuanto pude ver
hasta dónde se doblaba en la maleza"
Line 7: the word "claim" here means: a demand or request for something. What do you think is a good Spanish word for this?: ¿petición, pedido, reclamación ? Something else?
Line 14: I don't think "calles" is the best words to use here. It makes me think of paved streets. Maybe "sendero", since like "way" it can also mean "procedimiento o medio para hacer o lograr algo"
Line 15: He's doubting if it's even possible to go back, not wondering whether or not he should. Since one choice leads to the next and the past can not be undone and relived.
evfokas
сряда, 24/09/2014 - 07:01
Thank you for your feedback Jamilet
l7. I think claim here means that the path had the "right" to be worn because the other choices have less meaning: "and having perhaps the better demand" means that it's not the less traveled, "and having perhaps the better request" means that both roads asked for him. I would use derecho but I think it's stronger than claim the way it's used here
l15. He refers to events as they occurred the day he found himself at the crossroad and at that time he thought it was possible for him to return there (because he kept it in his mind) but he didn't think he would want to or it would be right to do so because there were many untraveled roads ahead. Back then he actually thought that it'd be possible to follow the other road too
Let's wait for Rosa
roster 31
сряда, 24/09/2014 - 16:26
Hola, a los dos!
Empiezo por el primer verso:
1. "Dos caminos se abrieron". Fine, but the verb "divergir" exists, and can be used. In any case, it must be in imperfect tense: "se abrían/divergían".
2. Second and third verses - "y lamentando no poder,,,/siendo un sólo viajero.../
"me quedé parado largo rato" (no 'un'); I must say, that "largo y tendido" is a common expression, perfectly acceptable.
Fourth and fifth - "miré EN uno") (?). What about, "En uno, miré tan lejos...", it's the same but I think it sounds better. /"doblaba" (not reflexivo).
3. Second stanza - "majo" is only used with people (nice and cute): "atractivo/atrayente";/"la mejor razón" ("razón" is fine but feminine)/ "ser gastado" (usado); you say "transitado" further down, it can also go here.
Next two verses, more or less: "en cuanto al hecho de pasar por allí, los había desgastado, más o menos, por igual" or "los había desgastado, en realidad, casi igual...".
4. Third stanza - You say ambos", I say "los dos".
Second verse - "...sin una huella negra de haber sido pisadas". Too long?
Third verse - Jami is right, "calle" is not the appropriate word but "sendero" is not either. "The word for "way", is "camino"; "sendero" is a "caminito". Nothing wrong repeating it here, although, I would say it only once: "... como un camino conduce a otro" / "...si tendría" (conditional, not imperfect), "si tendría que (a un punto), volver a empezar/dar la vuelta". This is the way I see it.
5. Last stanza - We say, "dentro de años y años".
* Stablished quote for "camino": "Todos los caminos conducen a Roma".
Grammatical corrections, are due corrections. Suggestions, are just suggestions.
evfokas
сряда, 24/09/2014 - 18:11
Thank you Rosa for your precious help
1. I think abrirse sounds more poetic, correct me if I'm wrong
2. Initially I used siendo but the english wording goes like "you can't do both and be one man" as in "you can't be one man and do both" not like "being one man you can't do both", does "ser" sound awful?
4. "Dar la vuelta" may be true but isn't the only possible meaning, here the other meaning is just to go back to taste the things he missed by going down the other road
The nice thing about this poem is that it can mean different things to different people so I don't want to add any meaning that isn't there or omit some that is. As I see it Frost is only saying that, no matter what, sometime in the future you'll look back nostalgically at some of your choices regardless of whether you consider them right or wrong.
I've cancelled proofreading but I'm still open to new suggestions
My spanglish "camino" quote: Este camino no fue una caminata en el parque
roster 31
сряда, 24/09/2014 - 22:31
Como te dije, así es como yo lo veo: el camino, es el camino a seguir en la vida.
1.Tuvo dos posibilidades, y tomó una. Pero como un camino le condujo al otro (al fin y al cabo el mismo camino) pensó, dudó: "¿Voy a volver a recorrer lo que ya he rrecorrido?"
2. I think it means "being one only traveler (man or woman), he couldn't take both.
Y mucho menos por un senderito. Es más como esta vieja fábula:
"Entre montes, por áspero camino,
tropezando en una y otra piedar,
iba un viejo, cargado con su leña,
maldiciendo su mísero destino..... " y sigue. ¿Quieres saber el resto?
I forgot: Third stanza = "Tomaré el PRIMERO"
NEW: Last stanza = you don't need "de aquí", o puedes decir, "lejos de aquí".
I didn't explain well: "¿Voy a volver a recorrer lo que ya he rrecorrido?", rather "¿Tengo que volver y recorrer lo que no he recorrido (en el otro camino?")
evfokas
четвъртък, 25/09/2014 - 07:35
Gracias Rosa creo que todas las correcciones se hicieron pero si tienes más en el futuro no dude en escribirlas. El poema se refiere a los caminos de la vida pero a mi modo de ver más específicamente a los caminos no tomados, las encrucijadas de la vida y la cuestión "¿qué pasaría..." que venga después de muchos años para torturarnos
Por supuesto me gustaría saber el resto de tu poema
ϕιλομαθής
сряда, 24/09/2014 - 19:38
Evan, me alegro de que estás traduciendo este poema y aún más que tú, Rosa, lo estés ayudando :) Si ustedes creen que "largo y tendido" expresa la idea mejor usen la. Sólo recuerdo que íbamos a despedirnos por la última vez de nuestros seres queridos cuando estaban "tendidos" en la funeraria. Perdonen me cuando hago preguntas tontas, pero, ¿cómo más puedo aprender?
evfokas
четвъртък, 25/09/2014 - 07:36
No problem Jamilet thank you for your help and for posting the poem, my only care is not to change its equivocal meaning. Actually idioms take precedence in the ears of native speakers over the meaning of the individual words; it's like if I said "I'm done for good", you wouldn't understand that something was done to me and certainly not for my good.
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