Pending moderation
Hi so I’m learning Portuguese and I’m at the point where I’m learning the possessive pronouns and I’m confused. I’ve searched this and it didn’t help so I’m asking here.
I’m learning Brazilian Portuguese so it’s teaching me você instead of tu, yet for the possessive pronouns it’s teaching both teu/tua and seu/sua for “your.” Naturally I was confused why there would be two, so I looked it up. The internet said to use seu/sua with você unless you’re talking to someone from northern Brazil then you’d use teu/tua with você. But that seems to be a regional thing so why is Duolingo teaching it?
Can someone please help me know when to use which?
Obrigada
The majority of Brazilians use "você/vocês" as well as "tu" interchangeably, interchangeably. It's very rare to see them use "vós" (the plural form of "tu") in spoken language unlike "você/vocês" and "tu" which are used a lot.
As you said, they even mix those words, for example:
"VOCÊ disse para eu TE dar dinheiro"
"You told me to give you money."
Well, you don't need to change the way you speak according to each region you go.
There are some Southerns who use "tu" with "tua/teu". They also use "você" sometimes. It's totally spontaneous.
The same goes for Northern Brazilians who use "tu" with "teu/tua/seu/sua" with no distinction. They also go for "você" just like the Southerns.
It's a very polemical subject.
http://i.imgur.com/rQcU0mc.png
https://imgur.com/eyOTbn4
Some people even studied that.
[@Thalyson Teixeira] So it's okay to mix você and te or teu/tua? Should I use você and teu or você and seu, or does it matter? Are they interchangeable?
I don't mix "você/vocês/seu/sua" with "tu/vós/teu/tua". You can see that in my translations,
but people tend to mix them given that conjugating verbs isn't very practicable/viable in Portuguese without consulting conjugation tables.
Look at this verb:
https://www.conjugacao.com.br/verbo-satisfazer/
"So it's okay to mix você and te or teu/tua? Should I use você and teu or você and seu, or does it matter? Are they interchangeable?"
Yes.
1) "Você e o seu pai são brasileiros" could either mean "A - you and his/her father are Brazilians" or "B - you and your father are Brazilians". People would understand that as B in the majority of contexts.
2) "Você e o teu pai são brasileiros." it just means "B - you and your father are Brazilians"
3) "Tu e teu pai são brasileiros." it still means "B - you and your father are Brazilians"
Oh, perfect. Is one more "correct" than the other?
This seems irregular but I'm not at a level of Portuguese where I would be able to tell yet
So, then, should I even bother learning tu at all, would someone from Portugal be able to understand você?
Yes, they do understand "você". But there are some Portuguese people who think that "você" is disrespectful and they simply drop it as much as they can. It's totally controversial.
An example of this topic is on Reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Portuguese/comments/3rt0vm/use_of_voc%C3%AA_in_...
That sounds super complicated! Thanks for answering my questions!
I have one more question actually, when to use "a gente" and when to just use "nos." I learned them both as we/us.
Well, I'll treat them as different kind of pronouns:
"A gente" is informal for "nós/nos"
As subjects:
"A gente é boba" / "Nós somos bobos"*/ "We are fool"
As objects:
"Ele agrediu a gente." / "Ele nos agrediu" / "He hit us"
As possessives:
"É o carro da gente." / "É o nosso carro" / "It's our car"
As possessives 2:
"O carro é da gente." / "O carro é nosso" / "The car is ours"
*Use "bobos" when there are men and women,
if there are only women or female identities, use "bobas"
a gente seems a bit more complicated to use haha
I would't ever write it on my tests.
It seems a bit complicated because of the preposition "da" as in "da gente" (which derived from "a gente").
So just use nos instead, mostly? and is there a difference between nós and nos
"Nos" is an object as "us".
"Nós" is a subject as "we"
Also, they both have different sounds.
Thanks for answering all my questions!
Oh, perfect. Is one more "correct" than the other?
It's not about whether they are incorrect or not. So you're right since you used quotation marks.
But I can tell you that none of them is as formal as "Tu e o teu pai são brasileiros", which every (or almost) Portuguese-speaking countries would accept.
No problem. Also, that subject is controversial as I said, so there'll be people who will disagree or agree either partially or totally.
So, essentially, it's best to learn all pronouns possible and just be careful of how I address people?
So tu would be more neutral? Seems easy enough to just use that then!
Portuguese seems so much more complicated than I ever would've thought! I'm glad I asked
So tu would be more neutral? Seems easy enough to just use that then!
Yes, but you'll also have to use "você" to better socialize with people in Brazil, not to mention that you'll sound more natural.
So, essentially, it's best to learn all pronouns possible and just be careful of how I address people?
In Brazil, you're free to use all pronouns as long as what you say makes sense.
voce if talking to someone from brazil, tu if Portugal. Got it!
Not necessarily - Southern Brazil still uses 'tu' more frequently than they do with 'você'.
At least in Rio, where I live, we don't use 'tu' as much. There are people who think that it will just fall into oblivion and disappear with time.
Oh my gosh this is confusing. So I need to be aware of the region the person I'm speaking to is from and use the pronoun that would be appropriate for that region?
You can use either, people will understand you just fine, though 'tu' is considered more formal - it's more usual with our European cousins. If you had to choose, I'd advise you to go with 'você'.
I guess this is one of the reasons why people say Portuguese is the hardest language for a foreigner to learn :P
Do you know about the Portuguese-speaking African countries and what they use?
Thanks for answering my questions but I'm still very confused. As I'm only a begginer I will focus more on voce for now (sorry I'm on an English keyboard and can't make the correct e) and when it comes time to actually use my portuguese I'll take tu or voce into more consideration.
It's very difficult, I studied French for several years but the nasal vowels in Portuguese are killing me lol
Sorry, but I do not =/ I want to, but I couldn't study African Portuguese yet.
That's alright, thank you. I have seen some songs on here in Portuguese from Angolan artists and it doesn't look very different but I also don't exactly know what I'm looking at yet :p
Africans also mix "você" with "tu".
I even noticed that some of them say things like:
"você conseguiste" instead of "tu conseguiste" or "você conseguiu" or "tu conseguiu".
Well...
Generically speaking, Brazil stands for "você" and Portugal for "tu", but it's not accurate since both of them are countries whose people don't speak homogeneously. It happens mostly because they don't live in the same regions (in the case of Brazil) or districts (in the case of Portugal). Also, when it comes to Southern Brazil, people tend to use "tu" more frequently than they do with "você" as Barroca himself said.
If you "take a magnifying glass", you will notice that not all regions of Brazil use "você", the same goes for the Portuguese districts (where people don't use "tu").
This is so complicated, I'm sorry! you've both explained it so well. I guess I shouldn't worry about this since I'm not to the point where I can speak or write in Portuguese yet.
No need to worry given that you are free to use both "você" and "tu" as you wish.