My translationσ take too long to appear on my page / don't appear at all

27 posts / 0 new
Editor
Joined: 24.10.2011
Pending moderation

Hello

It's been like a month or so and whenever I add a translation it usually takes too long to appear in my page or it appears only after I add another new translation. I've just added 4 translations however none of them appears in my page. If I go to the artist's page tho I can see them there. So the problem is appearing in my profile. (Also I don't think I'm getting my points after submitting the translation)

Moderator and Incorrigable
Joined: 03.06.2016

Ditto, no points for transliteration/translation

Editor True-to-original translations.
Joined: 29.08.2015

It might be related to this thread (don't know if you read it) https://lyricstranslate.com/en/forum/english-language/tranlation-request... but, as far as I know, this started a couple days ago not a month ago. I, for one, will not be adding anything till the problem is resolved.

Editor
Joined: 24.10.2011

@MichaelNa Νο it's been about a month this is happening . My translations appear but it takes too long or I have to add another one in order the previous one to appear. Now I've realised that my translations I made yesterday don't appear at all in my account as well. Also my "quote" button doesn't work at all. Whenever I press it it doesn't show anything.

Moderator / hippie-abraça-árvore
Joined: 30.04.2014

I think it is a recent general bug, as since yesterday I noticed that my new translation doesn't show on my profile and also the page views aren't counted anymore. But I remember there were bugs like this in the past and they got fixed. I think the admins are working on the site, implementing new features, so they might have accidentally caused this bug. I hope it will be fixed soon.

Editor
Joined: 06.10.2016

Thank God, I thought it only happened to me… I hope it's just a bug.

Moderator of Romance Languages
Joined: 31.03.2012

The same thing has happened to me. As of December 3, 2017 it has stopped counting my translations. I added 4 translation after my last one, none appear on my profile but the number of translation does update.
https://lyricstranslate.com/en/translations/0/0/none/none/phantasmagoria...

Guest

At last coming to my first words, because I was the first to put this big problem in the English section, then it was removed here, and everyone blamed me, accused me of my comprehension of English, conspiring theories, MY CAPITAL LETTERS, the so called by many clever people here as a trivial problem that I MADE IT TOO BIG and making fun of me like ''Thank you Zeus'' or some expression in Hebrew for congratulations and that my brain has the virus and not the forum.
#1 Fri, 08/12/2017 - 02:29 Like
Guest

To the moderators and to the editors of the forum:

The requested translation I was writing you about:
https://lyricstranslate.com/el/ypologismena-all-counted-down.html

My account (2 translations missing completely but are counted in my points):
https://lyricstranslate.com/en/translator/doctordepressionistas

The public account (2 translations appear but without view numbers only the thanks):
https://lyricstranslate.com/en/translations/0/0/none/none/doctordepressio...

Maybe some rules went the wrong way or have I done some mistake?
I am waiting for your help to solve my problem!

Moderator / hippie-abraça-árvore
Joined: 30.04.2014

No, you didn't do anything wrong, it's just a bug.
The admins here have been implementing some new features in the recent past, so I guess they messed something up in the code while trying to add more features and now they have to find the error.
We have to be patient...

At least the translations are not lost...

You deleted your account, so your translations appear now as been made by a "Guest".

Moderator
Joined: 21.06.2013

[@m.a.] No, please nobody meant to hurt you or anything. We apperciate you instead. But there's just one thing, all of us said that the bug was reported and would be solved soon, but you didn't seem to believe and calm down, there was no reason for you to delete your account. Nobody else besides you deleted their account, but in fact the bug is happening to all of us.

Guest

m.a., you're depressionista? Welcome back...

I'm sincerely sorry that you felt that some people there
didn't treat you with respect.

However... Taddy (an editor) and Flopsi (just an user like you and me)
tried their very best to listen to you, to find ways to reach out.
Didn't they do that?
They did what they could. Show them that you don't disrespect
them like the other guys disrespected you.

A few frat guys made jokes, so what? (Sorry to them for calling them that, but
they can take it if they can hand it out.)

Would you be holding grudges if some drunkards called you names on the street?
No, don't. It is not worth it. Let them go where the wind will take them.

Step 1:
Please relax , stay calm, and have patience. It may take a few days.

Super Member
Joined: 03.03.2017

I can't see my last translation too. But when I log out I can see it on my page.

Editor
Joined: 18.10.2015

Those who have been around here long enough might have noticed that things happen ( or happens Devil smile ?) while the Admins are trying to introduce changes into the site rules or procedures, which makes the site vulnerable to bugs. The question I've long been trying to get an answer to is who authorized them to enter those changes. It's a democratic site and all the present users must have equal rights to make decisions about it. Editors, mods and admins, in my opinion, are people who must have the same rights but more responsibilities. So any change should follow a public vote, a kind of a site referendum. It's technically easy. After a general discussion and all the users having been notified about the voting, there may be two posts, one in favour of a clearly presented change, the other in favour of the status quo.  The post that gets the majority of votes is the winner. At least everybody will be patient during the transitional period. Vox populi, vox Dei.
Now if a change occurs no one bothers to notify the users even post factum. As a result, the present rules of rating a translation, for instance, are humiliatingly discriminatory towards rarer (not minor!!!) languages and their speakers who must be, on the contrary, encouraged in every possible way. I'll have this topic covered in a separate post.
Anyway, difficulties can be overcome if everyone in the party clearly understands what they are doing and where they are going. Regular smile
 

Senior Member
Joined: 12.07.2016

I am in favour for this system but all people should follow a decree of putting forward valid argument for and against the notion. We should also understand that this website has a fundamental principle to give people translations, we shouldn't forget that this is a primary motive for all of us.

To @sandring:
Hard to believe you don't like politics?(°_° )

To @Osa:
I can take that. I am ready to be judged.

To @m.a.:
Glad to have you back mate. Rather than spending my day relaxing, I tried to get to the problem by scouting the website for tell tale signs of the problem. I could figure out an issue with server updation and another with links to several pages. All people here are ready to help any member, they helped me get ratings and I could actually discuss the topic of ratings as method to tell people their problems, bad ratings are not demeaning, etc.

To Moderator and Editor Team:
Can we get this person his work back? Transferring his translations to this account, it that possible?

To all Memebers:
Technically speaking if there is a change in the server, it is prone to bugs. We can do nothing except reporting it to LT directly by mail. We are not eligible to make changes to the server.

This message will be delayed by at least 2hrs.

Moderator
Joined: 21.06.2013

- To Moderator and Editor Team:
Can we get this person his work back? Transferring his translations to this account, it that possible?

I don't think it's possible. Unfortunately..

Moderator / hippie-abraça-árvore
Joined: 30.04.2014

No, it's possible, I've done it before for people who had deleted their account and opened a new one.

Moderator
Joined: 21.06.2013

Aren't his translations lost?

Moderator sapiens sapiens
Joined: 05.04.2012

[@m.a.] I moved your thread because the regional/language forums are not meant to talk about site issues or because you're writing in said language, but to ask about something in that language - I have explained it to you there and I'm doing the same here.

No one accused or blamed you of anything, instead you accused us of conspiring against you by deliberately causing a bug on your profile. If even Mods are suffering the issues caused by these bugs, then you shouldn't accuse anyone of anything.

For the umpteenth time, please calm down. The bug has already been reported and the Admins already know about it. And honestly, why did you delete your account?

@sandring new features are often suggested by Mods after someone asks them or after we discuss it. For instance, the Editor Room and the Website Rules came from these suggestions. The new translation rating system had to be implemented due to abuse, rule breaking and users attacking Mods when asked to review their ratings. I accept your thoughts, but I don't think that public vote would be a good thing - though I think that Mods and Editors can (and should) state their opinions.

@SAKAE he deleted both his accounts, now all of his translations shown up authored by 'Guest'. He may try to ask the Admins to manually restore his account and the translations but I don't know if that will work in this case as he deleted them himself.

Guest

@Sakae: Thank you. I think we all benefited from your participation. I think you're mature enough to know that a lack of knowledge is not mental illness.  If I offended you in any way,  it wasn't my intention  and you are bright enough to figure this out. If unfair, I'd apologize to you.  My "Website Activity" is turned off , and I still heard about the explosion going on here. But from it we can learn and ask new things.
My next point will link from you to @Sandring.
This is the forum "Report a problem, ask a question,"  and therefore what @Sandring's suggestions
are quite fitting here.@Sandring  is voicing concerns we can all discuss privately, and there is nothing wrong or "political" about her suggestions.  A lot of people often wonder what is going on with the website! Sandring is not the only one who's wondering what's up.  In case I am misunderstood, I will first make a disclaimer for anyone who may tell me this:

"You signed up and you agreed to the terms, and if you dislike them, you're free to take your bags and go!" 

That is a perfectly valid point, but I think it's non sequitur in a forum about asking questions.1) Could the Administration please think about a "News" feature to keep us all in the know about recent and upcoming events, such as the recent changes in the voting/ratings/stars system? They change overnight. If we cannot have polls or surveys as to what the people want, then we could at least get newsletters. :)  The polls thing would be cool, though. We could see recent polls. It would add to our sense of community.2)
Could the Administration please think about writing an expanded, revised, and updated guide to use LT (FAQ/Manual) in 2018? The present one continues to  discourage and confuse many users, novices or not. Furthermore, I wish to provide arguments in defense of my second question:

  •  Moderators often experience inconveniences, criticism, or even full-out abuse because they're held responsible for things beyond their control.   If their roles were clearly defined, then they would have a way to respond.    Often times, they have to battle it out and stay centered in the middle of a meltdown, even meltdowns coming from people with status gained by seniority. A new manual would help them defend themselves and save time.
  • Editors also experience trouble because people think they're the same as moderators. They sometimes do not even know how the moderator thing works because of a lack of transparency, or even less encouraging, because of a lack of contacts. 

The only way to learn to use LyricsTranslate "properly" is by trial and error, many trials and many errors, and by making contacts. It's come down to this. The rules are remnants from times when the website did not have its current features. We should all know and follow the rules (the ones that exist, not the ones that some new moderators invent, *wink, wink*), but we should also understand what is expected of us. A revised, updated, and expanded FAQ,  or  Guide, or Manual would be very helpful to new users, and I think it's a valid suggestion.  In order for people to feel at ease, we need less mystery. Another solution is that if events like this are prone to happening, we should limit the use of  certain forums while people gain experience.
Those are my questions, with some of my personal opinions and comments, and they are sent out in good will. If someone takes offense, then I apologize in advance.
 

Moderator / hippie-abraça-árvore
Joined: 30.04.2014

The admins are the ones who run and programm the website. We moderators only fix mistakes in lyrics, add missing videos, clean up spam and such things. We have a seperate forum where we discuss things like bugs or how to improve the website or talk about problematic users (people who submit Google translations or insult other members, for example).
But we have nothing to do with programming the website.
As far as I know the admins, who founded the site, live in Ukraine, I don't even know how many people they are and if they have real-life jobs that they have to dedicate time to.
There are the public forums, where all members can make suggestions about how to improve the website and if some good ideas turn up, they are usually discussed in the mods' forum, too. But I think it would be too tiresome to have polls with the whole community for every minor change on the website. Big issues are discussed here and I found the admins to be very balanced, trying to consider any reasonable criticism and trying to keep everyone happy.
If this bug now takes a few days to be fixed, then so be it. I don't know much about programming or what's going on in the lives of the admins to judge them for not being quick enough to fix it.

Guest

Maluca, I am not judging anybody at all - I am only trying to suggest ideas that you can all discuss in the moderator room. I agree with most if not all of what you said, except that I don't think it's so tiresome as all that.
As for the Administrators, they do their best too as most people here do. Regular smile

My ideas may or may not be good, but it's what is out there, according to my limited point of view.
But if it sounded like I was passing judgment on anyone, then I apologize to you for that, because
you're the last person I would seek to offend among many here.

Moderator / hippie-abraça-árvore
Joined: 30.04.2014

No, I was just generally speaking, not addressing you personally.
In my job I work in a team with 6-7 people and it is already tiresome to discuss everything with such a small number of people...

We're on the internet here, so everyone can voice his or her ideas, but having a poll about everything I think would not improve the site, also because most people don't bother. It doesn't even work on the big scale, see Brexit and Catalunya referendum...

Moderator and Incorrigable
Joined: 03.06.2016

Since it's been brought up there are things needing addressed:

These policy changes without blanket notification are unacceptable. They breed distrust and resentment.
It has been my thought that Editors and Moderators were part of a representative government. A democracy in place here then.
They don't run by slipping pieces of paper under the door. Chat boxes are insufficient. When I read your words here I get an idea of what you are trying to say, your intentions, your motives, your attitude. That is equally important. There seems to be a need for open communication with admin. personnel.

Moderators are absolutely right about conflicts. I have fielded many behind the scenes conflicts where users contacted me. We need to all be on the sheet of music. Those who were effected by these issues were contacted by me very confidentially and professionally.
We are all a team. That means everytime, all of the time. The mission is to maintain order, quality, and assist in any way that we are permitted as outlined.
If we are not able to perform our jobs then new criteria need to be placed.

This point problem and posting problem sucks...admin. knows. They have been contacted. So it's on them. I have noticed that entries show on the artist's page. Make copies in your documents file or store them on a flash drive. Adapt, improvise, and overcome.

This voting policy is biased against those who do unpopular/uncommon languages. No votes for them. Declaring fluency is a matter of self review only. For those languages that are common a rule of say one a week, two a week might have been an option. My votes prior to this ruling were few and very well deserved. I no longer can vote for anyone. That's truly a shame. I know there is abuse, it's been very obvious. Those entries within my expertise show it well. So something should be done. But not in the current manner.

Comments; There needs to be some outlines for them. There is often material I see that is not pertinent to the song. Things that belong in PMs. Also, the rule should be, if you don't want to read it about you, then don't post it in a place for all to see. Confidentiality is key. Especially amongst Editors and Moderators. A song two couplets long and three pages of comments. Kind of takes away from the artist's effort doesn't it? Remember the user has sovereignty.

Wrong languages; There are many songs that are posted in a different text or language than the song in the video. An example Chinese text and the song is Mongolian. Allowing this to occur alienates nations. Alienates sponsors, alienates viewers. It hurts everyone. Idioms posted and explained only in a user's language often show reveal an incorrect idiom and a wrong explanation. There are many entries that are useless. They cannot be fixed or explained properly and are not a part of the language they are in. They may be explanations of a foreign idiom but posted in the user's language. This problem covers all continents.

Multiple versions of one song; Confusion, five versions or more of one song...perhaps they need to be voted on and the excessive ones removed. Songs should be as close to the languages as possible and convey the artist's intent and style. Lyrics should be close enough as to be able to be used as a learning tool, a reinforcing tool for a language being learned. Those copied from other sources have no regulation and it's obvious to see. It takes away from those who work hard.

If this site is a democracy then all policy changes need to be discussed by the representatives (Editors and Moderators) and if needed effected users. A considered policy change needs to be in an open forum where users have the ability to have input. Then it goes to the Editors and Moderators and then to Admin.. Any general policy needs to have input so that unforeseen problems can be minimized. They need to be voted on. All votes equal. Right now things are in chaos. Your designated positions come with a responsibility to others first. We all put time into this site and have a vested interest in it.

*If a user cannot speak English or another commonly used language then that needs to be addressed. In the website rules it should be written in multiple languages that they should contact Editors, Moderators in a common forum that they can see so that if the language is unusual it can be dealt with. That way no one gets left out, no one feels alone and alienated. Users shouldn't blow in, and out like autumn leaves. I am sure there are other issues to discuss, but this is a door just opening.

Editor
Joined: 18.10.2015

@SAKAE I don't like politics because I like democracy Regular smile I hope you know what I mean. You and I have discussed some Hindi-English translations. Do you think I can tell a good Hindi-English translation? I think I can. May I rate it? No, I may not. Such are the rules. Does it make you happy? According to your previous forum post, it doesn't. I track down all the Hindi users on the site to seek advice if necessary. There's usually only one at a time. So who's to rate your translations then? There are users who studied Hindi but what can they do? So when it comes down to rare languages speakers on this site they should, instead of getting a deserved encouragement, remember an old marketing trick "If you want a discount Bring along a friend!" Do you think it's fair towards any language and my beloved Hindi in particular?

@Alma Barroca Juan, I know how trying it is to be an admin, mod or even an editor for such a diverse international community. But if the site major rules are backed up by the majority of users through an overall polls result (not just individual opinions) it will empower the site administration to stand up to all kinds of instigations, insinuations or open insults from certain individuals. Vox populi!

@Ww Ww Teamwork is the keyword and the right touch! Thank you!

@Osa I agree that all the rules should be transparent and blanket notified about if updated. Good point, thank you. Regular smile

Guest
Quote:

Comments; There needs to be some outlines for them. There is often material I see that is not pertinent to the song. Things that belong in PMs. Also, the rule should be, if you don't want to read it about you, then don't post it in a place for all to see. Confidentiality is key. Especially amongst Editors and Moderators. [...]

Can you please provide some examples? How streamlined must comments be, exactly?
Nobody knows because the only rule that has been published is that we must remain civil
and courteous...

This has caused confusion before for me personally.
If the rules are not written down and found on this website, then how is one to follow them?

All that the rules say is that one must be civil.

If we are collaborating, with whom are we collaborating? I wish there were an "About" page, at least.
The way I learned about this website's being based in Ukraine was because moderators shared this with me.

Also, I have read your profile many times before, WwWw, and that is the only place
where I have read that this is a collaboration. At first I thought it was just one user's opinion, but
if indeed LT is a project, why are users never told of this?

Thank you.

Note:
I edited this post to add to it, and to clarify my first question.

Moderator and Incorrigable
Joined: 03.06.2016

I can provide examples however I do not want someone thinking I am picking on them (no witch hunt). The best method is to observe the Site Activity log as I do. When comments start becoming personal then it gains my interest. As you have said there should be civility. When comments are not civil then they gather my undivided attention.

Rules...you are very right about how to follow them. The inherent problem with making too many of them is that no one would be able to do anything. Most behavior should be judged by what is considered 'common courtesy'. Doing unto others as you would have them do unto you. There must be some ambiguity for creative freedom. The question is to keep that balance. You are more interested in knowing where you stand. We all do.

You are absolutely right on the 'About Page'. For two years I watched this site without a word. One of the reasons was exactly what you are saying, no distinct answers. This is a common concern because one's association with others and their organizations might have an undesired effect on a potential user's career and such. Many people have learned that social media can be a liability. Many people are just starting their lives, their careers, so it is extremely important to take the right path.

Collaboration, means teamwork. As for teamwork, it is a must. Otherwise it's just people bumping heads constantly. The whole purpose here is to open channels through songs, poetry, etc. throughout the world. Since this is an organization in order to maintain itself it requires constant attention to work efficiently and effectively. Most of the Editor and Moderators have communicated at various times on various issues. We all try be good coaches and managers. The professionalism standard is high.

Many users have come to me in frustration via PM, emails, and chat. Most of the time their frustrations cite comments and issues between individuals. That is why I am opposed to the lack of confidentially and empathy in comments. It shouldn't be conceived to be a public stoning (trolls galore), nor as a socialization venue. As you read in my profile and will see if you view all of my comments, no negative feedback, or feedback that could be thought to be negative is communicated by me to anyone here. PMs/emails require a direct person to person intervention. I send PMs. They are always positive in nature, always with options. I respect the user's right to choices (as long as they are within site rules). This hopefully will become a common practice amongst all. There has been no final collaboration on it amongst Editors, Moderators, etc.. Most comments are brief and to the point. That is what they should be. When they are no longer applicable they need to disappear (to tidy everything up ). A new potential user coming on board looks at that and thinks...maybe not. See what I mean.

I would like that to be in a forum format (confidential), and if results are of users' concerns then it should be posted in a user forum that is always available. There should be a real public forum so outside aspiring users might be more apt to contribute.

What you are asking of, a project is exactly of what I am speaking. I do not see a clear mission statement, a clear chain of command (above Editors and Moderators). I speak of names, faces, etc.. It is all shadows. You are not the first to recognize this. I recognize they feel a need for anonymity, however it does lead to questions of intent and values. It creates and 'us and them' attitude. All websites cost money to maintain and require management and maintenance, a clear purpose. Those operations should be explained so everyone is 'on the same sheet of music'.

I repeat myself about teamwork. This is an international (informal/formal?) project. That means in every facet. If the standard is kept high by all, then this combined effort of ours is maintained and all feel, and are important and a community. If not, it's the land of bickering and trivialities. Easily seen in communications.

A new user, like me once too is unsure as to what are the expectations. An example; I didn't know if I should translate word for word, or translate ad libitum/poetic license involved. To me it was a major problem. So torn between both I proceeded to translate. There was an overabundance of negative criticism and a very small amount of positive, empathetic feedback. That wasn't very conducive to becoming part of a team or to learning/knowing the unwritten norms here. There is an ocean of potential input out there. It should be nurtured. Do you see what I mean? Our communication here (between us now) is initial feedback for some, so immediate results are unrealistic. Hopefully though this can start dialogue and help to foster a team/collaborating attitude that creates open channels of communication and problem solving by all those who read this.

Guest

I was not asking you to name people or examples of past events (sorry that I didn't clarify that), but
rather examples of the kinds of comments that should be there.

I am opposed to extremes: if the comments are too cold, that does not encourage team work; if they are too
warm, that isn't wrong either per se--- but others get offended or feel excluded. I tend to err on the side
of being too warm. It is a very tenuous balance, and I do see LT as a project.

Thanks so much for writing back in such detail. I understand your point of view, and I think LT is a
collaborative website. However, it doesn't have a mission statement, as you point out. Therefore,
we cannot prompt others who have a colder or more individualistic philosophy to follow along.

I actually assumed that team work was a matter of fact, and it was not. I found out the hard way.
That is what I found surprising about the website.
You assume that I am worried about my own standing-- we all are ; nobody wants to get banned, for example.

But when I first found this website, my
main goal was to help other people while having a hobby, not to promote my work, as I'm not a professional.
Regular smile

Then I see that there is too much rivalry and conflict is easy to emerge, as in any normal
organization. The reason I turn off my Site Activity is
not because I don't care, but because I have a problem myself: I'm extremely sensitive, and I
do not think I need the amount of stuff that can come from daily conflicts. Some people will easily overcome
a few harsh words and laugh them off. I feel things very deeply, and it's best that I protect myself, first and foremost.
Why? If I'm unwell, I can't help others.

Quote:

Do you see what I mean? Our communication here (between us now) is initial feedback for some, so immediate results are unrealistic. Hopefully though this can start dialogue and help to foster a team/collaborating attitude that creates open channels of communication and problem solving by all those who read this.

Yes, I see what you mean, and I appreciate the spirit that you support. We all have individuals styles of working,
but I think civility and treating others as well as possible is essential.
Thank you for laying out in so much detail some of your ideas, and I hope that we can find out more
about the goals of the website in the future. Thanks very much !

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