Neon Moon (러시아어 번역)

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러시아어 번역러시아어
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Неоновая луна

Когда садится солнце
В моей части города,
Чувство одиночества
Подступает к моим дверям.
Весь мир мрачнеет.
 
Вон там есть захудалый бар
По ту сторону железнодорожных путей.
Для меня есть столик на двоих
У чёрного хода,
Где я сижу в одиночестве
И размышляю о том, что потерял тебя.
 
Я провожу почти каждую ночь
Под светом
Неоновой луны.
 
Если ты теряешь свою единственную,
Здесь всегда есть место для одинокого,
Чтоб наблюдать за тем, как твои разбитые мечты
Танцуют в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.
 
Я думаю о двух молодых влюблённых,
Бегущих безудержно и свободно.
Я закрываю свои глаза,
И иногда вижу
Тебя в полумраке
Этой полной табачного дыма комнаты.
 
Не рассказать, как много слёз пролил
Я, сидя здесь и горюя.
Или как много лжи
Я наговорил
Своему бедному сердцу о том,
Что она когда-нибудь вернётся.
И всё же, со мной всё будет в порядке,
Пока есть свет, идущий
От неоновой луны.
 
Если ты теряешь свою единственную,
Здесь всегда есть место для одинокого,
Чтоб наблюдать за тем, как твои разбитые мечты
Танцуют в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.
 
Музыкальный автомат играет дальше
Рюмка за рюмкой.
Слова каждой грустной песни,
Кажется, говорят о том, что я думаю.
И это терзает мою душу,
И это никогда не закончится.
 
И всё же, со мной всё будет в порядке,
Пока есть свет, идущий
От неоновой луны.
 
Если ты теряешь свою единственную,
Здесь всегда есть место для одинокого,
Чтоб наблюдать за тем, как твои разбитые мечты
Танцуют в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.
 
Чтоб наблюдать за тем, как твои разбитые мечты
Танцуют в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.
 
Чтоб наблюдать за тем, как твои разбитые мечты
Танцуют в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.
 
투고자: Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko, 月, 16/09/2019 - 07:03
최종 수정: Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko, 水, 18/09/2019 - 17:20
영어영어

Neon Moon

코멘트
Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    月, 16/09/2019 - 22:31

Very nicely done. I've delete my horrible translation. There are just a few errors:
"There's no telling how many tears I sat here and cried" means "I have no idea how many tears I cried while sitting here." It doesn't mean "Don't tell me know many tears I cried. I'm sitting here grieving."

The only other problem is:
Здесь всегда есть место для одинокого.
Чтобы рассмотреть свои несбывшиеся мечты,
Танцуй в лучах и вне лучей
Неоновой луны.

In English he's saying "Watch your dreams dance in the beams." It's poetic, like "watch the years pass by". He's not saying, "Watch your broken dreams. And, dance in the beams." (Nobody is dancing.)

Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko    火, 17/09/2019 - 04:39

Dear Phil, I understand the meaning of the phrase "There's no telling how many tears I sat here and cried" and translated it correctly. In Russian the sentence fragment "Не рассказать" means "Я не могу рассказать" - I can’t tell (how much, because it was so many times that I can’t even approximately estimate). In addition, the Russian language lacks the participle formed from the verb "плакать" (to cry), so I was forced to replace it with a close one that is formed from the verb "горевать" (to grieve). My translation into Ukrainian is more accurate. The participle clause in Russian grammar has to be separated by comma. This comma corresponds to an intonation pause; it does not break the sentence into parts in meaning.

Thank you for clarifying the meaning of the phrase "Watch your dreams dance in the beams".
I have corrected my translation, thank you very much.

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    火, 17/09/2019 - 17:21

Thank you for your translation. My Russian is (of course) horrible. But, that's to be expected from someone whose language is based upon archaic-German, trying to understand a language based upon archaic-Slavic. I must say, that it's gotten a little bit easier as Russia has adopted more English sayings. But, still Russian will always be Slavic, and English will always be whatever the hell it's become. LOL
Once again thanks for the translation. Wink smile

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    火, 17/09/2019 - 17:49

Oh, and by the way, not knowing that Russian has no participle form of плакать, I would've just created it using grammar rules. LOL
I often do that, and Russians are amused (and disgusted) by my creations.
For future reference, feel free to use my creation - past passive participle: плаченный lol.
We English speakers are so used to irregular participles that violate all grammar rules, it's common for us.

drink, drank, drunk (correct)
drink, drank, {"drunk" is unused, or misused as "drank", to avoid sounding like they're admitting that they're "drunk"}
I've drank too much tonight.
{More commonly, to avoid this all together, we rarely if ever say this, and use a construction that avoids the past tense participle of "drink" all together:} I've had too much to drink tonight.

think, thank, thunk?
think, thought, thought.
thank, thanked, thanked
thunk, thunked, thunked

blink, blank, blunk?
blink, blinked, blinked
blank, blanked, blanked
blunk, blunked, blunked

spit, spat, spat.
shit, shat, shat?
shit, shit, shit. {I guess we just love that word! LOL}

One last very funny English verb "to behave".
Every child when first learning to speak will always mess this up, automatically because it makes no sense, the way it sounds.

Mother: "Behave!"
Child: "I am being haved."
Mother: "No, dear. The proper English is 'I am behaving."

Never found a child who didn't mess that one up. You're English is excellent, despite the fact that English is so messed up. My Russian, however... Well, you saw my translation. LOL

Keep up the good work, and thank you!

Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko    水, 18/09/2019 - 01:18

Dear Phil, let me give a little explanation about the formation of the participles in the Russian language.

The fact is that the participle in Russian is not exactly what the participle in English. As far as I know, in English there are two types of participles traditionally called present participle and past participle. For the formation of the progressive tense and perfect tense, it is necessary to use the corresponding participles. In Russian the participles are not needed to express an ongoing or completed action. There are two different sets of perfective and imperfective verbs for this. Imperfective verbs can take the form of past, present or future tense, and perfect verbs can take the form of past or future tense. In addition, two separate parts of speech can be formed from verbs. If those parts of speech are formed from imperfective verb then they are similar in meaning to the present participle, and if they formed from the perfective verb then they are similar in meaning to the past participle. One of these two parts of speech is called причастие (literally "participle"). This part of speech has the characteristics of a verb and an adjective simultaneously (in Ukrainian this part of speech is called дієприкметник – literally "verbal adjective"). Another part of speech is called деепричастие and has the characteristics of verb and adverb at the same time (in Ukrainian this part of speech is called дієприслівник – literally "verbal adverb"). Usually, this part of speech is used to express some secondary action performed simultaneously with the main action expressed by the verb that is present in the sentence. In modern Russian, actions expressed by the деепричастие and the verb-predicate must belong to the same subject of action. Beside that, it is possible to form the причастие from every verb but деепричастие can not be formed from some verbs (in Ukrainian, the opposite is true.)

The word "плаченный" you created is причастие. And there was no need to invent it since in Russian there are words "плачущий" (present tense) and "плакавший" (past tense). For use in translation, I needed the деепричастие which can’t be formed from the verb "плакать" but could sound like "плакая" (which is not right at all) or "плача". The second option can be heard in colloquial speech (rarely), but, of course, not in the literary language. Understanding such a word is difficult due to ambiguity. Firstly, it coincides in form with the genitive case of the noun "плач" (the lamentation). Secondly, it is not clear from which verb such a деепричастие is formed: from the verb "плакать" (to cry) or from the verb "платить" (to pay). The forms of these verbs when they conjugated sometimes coincide, but they can be recognized by stress. Not without reason in the Russian language there is a saying based on the play on the words: "Плачу́ и пла́чу" ("When I pay then I cry").

Thank you for attention. I hope that I did not tire you with my monologue.

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    水, 18/09/2019 - 06:04

Oh Michael, yes I learned about Russian noun and adjective cases and declensions, singular and plural. I learned about imperfective and perfective verb conjugations particle and participle constructions. Although I have to admit I still don't understand либо or лишь. But rather than use all the linguistic terms (which I know and understand), I'll explain my understanding of Russian participles as simply as I can using English equivalents:

The boy reading the book. Читающий мальчик.
The book being read. Читаемая книга.
The boy who was reading the book. Читавший мальчик.
The boy who read the book. Прочитавший мальчик.
The book that was being read. Читанная книга.
The book that was read. Прочитанная книга.
While reading... Читая
Having read... Прочитав

But, as you said, only a Russian would know which are commonly used. Like only an American would know that we don't say, "I have drunk too much tonight." For this reason, a non-fluent speaker has the opportunity to "create" using standard grammar rules of any language, something that is NOT used by fluent speakers.

I understand everything you said, mainly because I have already learned these things in school, albeit in English. But, it truly seemed that the teachers were more concerned in teaching what the "dative noun declension for a singular neuter object" would be, rather than how such a construction is used. And, therein lies my problem. I understand that grammar (though I mess it up sometimes), but it's almost impossible to understand how a native actually uses these grammar rules in common speech.

Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko    水, 18/09/2019 - 11:04
Quote:

I understand that grammar (though I mess it up sometimes), but it's almost impossible to understand how a native actually uses these grammar rules in common speech.

Unfortunately, I have the same problem with English.

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    水, 18/09/2019 - 18:49

Your English is stellar! I see no problems with it at all. Don't put yourself down.

JadisJadis    水, 18/09/2019 - 12:41
Michael Didenko wrote:

As far as I know, in English there are two types of participles traditionally called present participle and past participle.

So is it in French. But in Latin, there was also a future participle (active : morituri te salutant, passive : Carthago delenda est) : for such phrases, we have to use a periphrasis ; in English, in the case of the book and its reader, it would be for example : the man about to read the book, the book going to be read by the man (?)). I thought I remembered that there was one in Portuguese too, but can't find any examples any more, perhaps it died unexpectedly.

silencedsilenced    水, 18/09/2019 - 12:52

going to be read -> "about to be read" works just as well. "about to" is the mark of the future, independent of the passive/active voice.
English future uses auxiliaries anyway, so it's difficult to compare it with languages where the verbs themselves change.

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    水, 18/09/2019 - 19:11

I have created an English (active / passive) verb construction spreadsheet. It's an absolute nightmare. I never really noticed how complicated English verbs are until I undertook this task.

As for the passive "the book is going to be read" (which uses the past passive participle of "read" (REED) which is "read" (RED), that is NOT the same as the active which does not use a participle at all, just an infinitive. "I am about to read the book".
It's really a subtle nuance, and English is full of them with our verbs. Russian, however, uses subtle nuance in their adjectives and nouns. This is a MAJOR problem when translating from the one language to the other.

Subtly, "I'm about to read the book" implies that "I want to read this book, but something is delaying me from reading it."
I can't imaging anyone ever saying "the book is going to be read", it's so awkward. I'm 55 and I have never said that or heard that in my life. BUT, using that same construction, there are some verbs that work with it:

EX: "The play is going to be narrated by Mr. John Frost." And, that is exactly the same as "Mr. John Frost is going to narrate the play."

If anyone wants a copy of my nightmarish English verb conjugation chart as a PDF file, PM me, and give me your e-mail and I'll send it to you.

Not enough time here to explain the horror that is English verb constructions.

There is ONE GOOD THING at least with English verbs! Unlike all other Germanic languages, a long time ago English peasants destroyed the English subjective case, and throughout history (when they finally became literate) replaced it with an infinitive through a spelling mistake:

"I should like that thou wouldst go to the market." {Olde English}
became: "I would like that you would go to the market." {Thou was eliminated, and should/shall changed their meanings}
became: "I'd like that you'd go to the market." {Simple peasant contractions}
then the conjunction "that" became optional so peasants would say: "I'd like you'd go to the market."
But they were saying it, and were illiterate. When they learned to write, they wrote what they were saying as it sounded:
"I'd like you to go to the market." Which is grammatically wrong, but it's been part of English ever since, and the subjective case was destroyed. Hooray! Go peasants!!! Go peasants!!!

BratBrat    木, 19/09/2019 - 01:40

About books: in Russia there are some huge libraries using conveyor belts to deliver books from storage to readers.
If you saw a book on such a belt you would probably ask ''Where is that book going to?'' And ''This book is going to be read'' would be a nice answer to your question.

JadisJadis    火, 17/09/2019 - 18:10

I wonder : "If you lose your one and only", doesn't that mean "your one and only love", or something like that ?

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    火, 17/09/2019 - 18:57

Yes, exactly. "If you lose your one and only." It's like saying, "If you lose the one person who was meant to be with you for your whole life." It comes from the idea that there's one "perfect" person for everyone, somewhere. So, he's saying, "If you lose the person who was perfect for you." Or something like that. In this case, "lose" doesn't mean that she died. In most cases "to lose someone" means that they died. But from this song's content, it's obvious that he was just an asshole, and she left him. He's just pining over the fact that he was an idiot, treated her so bad that she left him, and she was the perfect woman for him. A lot of country songs are like that, but normally they're sung by women. But, in true Country Song style, he had to go to a bar and get drunk. Country songs are like that. There's a joke (it's been around for years) that to make a country song, you have to have some specific things in it. "Alcohol" is a must! LOL.

Here is a lyric from "The Perfect Country Song"

Well, I was drunk the day my mom got out of prison
And I went to pick her up in the rain
But before I could get to the station in my pickup truck
She got run over by a damned old train

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkKn5HrKgHQ

silencedsilenced    火, 17/09/2019 - 19:03

That was as funny to read as it was informative Teeth smile

Pinchus ZelenogorskyPinchus Zelenogorsky    水, 18/09/2019 - 12:56

Если позволите, несколько замечаний:
>В моём конце города,
Допустимо, но так не говорят. "в моей части города", "в моем районе", "в моей квартале" и т.п.
>Весь мир становится омрачившимся.
А вот так категорически не говорят. "Становится мрачным", "омрачается", "становится омраченным", "мрачнеет"
>И размышляю о потере тебя.
И это весьма странно звучит. "о том, что потерял тебя", "о твоем уходе"
>Чтоб посмотреть, как твои несбывшиеся мечты
"посмотреть" не подходит для регулярного, повторяющегося действия. "смотреть", "наблюдать", "изучать" и т.п. К тому же мечты не "несбывшиеся", а "разбитые".
Как мечты могут танцевать "в лучах и вне лучей"? На русском звучит странно.
> Или как много лжи // Я наврал,
Нельзя "врать ложь" - это не по-русски.

Michael DidenkoMichael Didenko    水, 18/09/2019 - 17:45
Цитат:

>В моём конце города,
Допустимо, но так не говорят. "в моей части города", "в моем районе", "в моей квартале" и т.п.

Ну, у Вас так, может быть, не говорят, а у нас говорят. Как там в песне у Потапа и Насти Каменских:
"У нас на районе не звоня́т, а зво́нят".
Но вот как точно не говорят, так это "в моей квартале" (говорят "в моём квартале"). Regular smile

Цитат:

>Чтоб посмотреть, как твои несбывшиеся мечты
"посмотреть" не подходит для регулярного, повторяющегося действия.

Так, а кто говорит о регулярности?
Это тот мужик, от лица которого поётся песня, регулярно бухает. Однако, это не значит, что слушатель, к которому он обращается, должен делать это регулярно.

По-поводу танца в лучах cогласен, для русского языка это звучит необычно, но смысл этой фразы является переносным. Здесь используется поэтическая метафора. Об этом писал Phil в своем первом комментарии. (Я, поначалу, даже не разобрался в смысле этих строк песни).

OK, за замечания спасибо. Большинство из них я учёл и перевод поправил. Где-то, возможно, при этом пришлось чуть отойти от оригинального текста песни, но, думаю, перевод от этого только стал лучше. Ещё раз спасибо!

BratBrat    水, 18/09/2019 - 18:06

Hi, Phil! плаченный would in fact mean 'being paid' according to your classification.
And the past passive participle form of плакать would be плаканный.

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    水, 18/09/2019 - 19:17

Ah, you're going to make me pay! Whoops! I mean cry. I always got those messed up in Russian. It was really funny when I was at a Russian restaurant, and asked for the bill and misplaced the accent, and said "I'm crying!" LOL

BratBrat    木, 19/09/2019 - 01:23

Well, Russia's not the only place where people are crying while paying...

BratBrat    木, 19/09/2019 - 01:49

С этими русскими глаголами на ровном месте анекдотические ситуации возникают: когда в русском ресторане принесли счет, иностранец кричал: ''Я заплАчу!'' А когда прочитал счёт до конца, действительно заплакал... Wink smile

Phil AmbroPhil Ambro    木, 19/09/2019 - 03:46

I can only imagine that it's worse here with our restaurant prices. LOL
Reminds me of a Russian joke where a young man asks his father "Папа. Можете ли вы переводить сто доллоров?"
And the father said, "Ha какой язык?"

Similar jokes in English:
A knight runs into the castle screaming, "THE PEASANTS ARE REVOLTING!!!"
The king calmly replies, "They certainly are."