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    Dandelion – * * *

    英語 の翻訳

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* * *

«Мы жизнь придумываем сами...»
Ф.
 
Мы жизнь придумываем сами,
Любовь придумываем сами
И лезем длинными носами
Туда, где светит медный таз.
Веками, днями и часами
Мы балуемся словесами.
Мы жизнь придумываем сами,
А смерть придумают за нас.
 
英語
翻訳#1#2#3

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" We make the life to suit our ways..."
F.
 
We make our life to suit our ways,
We make our love to suit our ways
And stick our long nose into a place
Where the sun don't shine.
For centuries, hours and days
We fool around with words we say.
We make the life to suit our ways,
But have no say in the way we are dying.
 

"* * *"の翻訳

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英語 #1, #2, #3
コメント
Vera JahnkeVera Jahnke    月, 02/09/2019 - 21:31

"Where the moon don't shine" = 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   木, 05/09/2019 - 08:55

Sorry, I've messed up. It should be: where the sun don't shine.

silencedsilenced    水, 04/09/2019 - 22:50

We make the life... -> I don't think the article works here. It prompts the question "which life?".

The unshining moon had me chuckling too. I would rather have used the sun, but I learned most of my English from the UK :)
However, I'm curious about the original meaning.
If I understood Vera's German footnote correctly, this would be a mix of "накрыться медным тазом" (something like "going to pot", right?) and the "things look good" meaning of "светить" (like Vysotsky's "нам не светит с тобою", for instance).

So that would be something like making the worst possible plans, that look very promising but are bound to fail miserably?
Or what turn did I miss?

no say the way we are dying -> wouldn't that be "no say in the way..."?

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   水, 04/09/2019 - 23:07

Thank you for the comment. I don't like that idiom about the" Медный таз" It doesn't make any sense to me. As I was growing up and lived for awhile in Ukraine, we have never used that expression. I think, to stick your noses where the moon don't shine is very appropriate and makes a lot of sense. Also, the line "To hit a brass plate for the sun" in Sandring's version, is absolutely doesn't make sense and doesn't correlate with sticking noses. And I did corrected few things , as you have suggested. And you are correct about the sun.

silencedsilenced    水, 04/09/2019 - 23:06

I quite like the way you translated it. I reads very well, and I guess the general idea is to busy oneself doing the stupidest possible thing anyway :D
I was just curious about the Russian. I guess the expression is not very common then?

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   水, 04/09/2019 - 23:17

Not where I came from. In the city of Odessa we had our own unic Russian, like nowhere else. It was colourful, full of humor and intermixed with many other languages: Greek, Idish, Ukrainian, French,Italian. I know, for example , that the butchers at Odessa produce market were using Greek words to swear at the customers, so they wouldn't understand them. Many of slang phrases we were making up ourselves and using only in our suburbs between ourselves. This is just a little taste what our city was than. Now, half of the population, left the city, to look for a better life, taking a lot of the humor with them, and thus making this city poorer for that.

PinchusPinchus    水, 04/09/2019 - 23:29

I live in St. Petersburg. "Медный таз" was rather popular, when I was young ("медные тазы" were wide used for cooking jam). Now is not so popular, I guess (basins and expression too)

silencedsilenced    水, 04/09/2019 - 23:43

Right! So what do you make of this strange "shiny brass bowl" then? :)

PinchusPinchus    水, 04/09/2019 - 23:48

I continue to cook jam from apples, cowberries and black ashberry. Someone, may be, handed over for scrap. I like old things. My refrigerator, for example, celebrated 40th anniversary recently.

BlackSea4everBlackSea4ever    水, 04/09/2019 - 23:56

My lord, between you and 42, I'm desperate for some jam. My mom made incredible ones. If Pierre won't be silent and adds French pastries, I'd be lost.
Brass basin - it's an unusual phrase in my experience, but Одуванчик explained it, no?

silencedsilenced    木, 05/09/2019 - 00:53

Only a debilitating sickness can stop my waggling tongue. That's the idea behind my new nickname.

Luckily for you, French pastries are too posh for me. It's been literally years since I last bought one. That's a perfect theme for a social comment though. I might make another Yellow Jacket rant out of it.

Now seriously, folks. To be honest I was overwhelmed by the comments in Russian and German scattered across 4 different translations, not to mention those removed for reasons I can imagine but would rather not dig into. Amidst the chaos, I might have missed a crucial bit of information.

So if you would just tell me what you make of my interpretation, that might spare me a lot of confusion. I'm willing to throw in a free French translation to sweeten the deal :D

BlackSea4everBlackSea4ever    木, 05/09/2019 - 01:09

This is what Lena, the poem's author said:

dandelion wrote:

С медным тазом вот какая история. Во-первых, есть идиома "накрыться медным тазом". Это означает неудачное, провальное окончание какой-то затеи, когда всё плохо, все планы рушатся и никаких надежд уже нет. Причём, связано это, как правило, с непреодолимыми внешними причинами. Можно сказать, например, так: я собиралась поехать в Италию, но моя поездка накрылась медным тазом (не смогла купить билеты, приехали в гости родственники и т.п.) С другой стороны, "светит" здесь изначально использовано в переносном смысле - речь идёт о вероятном развитии событий. Например: ему светит исключение из университета, увольнение с работы и т.п. Можно использовать и с отрицанием - например, "мне здесь ничего не светит" - и тогда уже тоже речь идёт о неоправданных надеждах. То есть "светит медный таз" - это то же самое, что "ничего не светит". Даже немного хуже: можно этим медным тазом по башке получить (то есть, испытать внезапную сильную боль, унижение, шок - чаще говорят "как пыльным мешком по голове", хотя это слабее). Но дословный перевод тоже имеет смысл, не менее важный! Я об этом писала в комментарии к своему стиху. Именно поэтому мне очень интересно, какие ассоциации может вызывать этот предмет (медный таз). И не обязательно в таком контексте.

So, whatever your interpretation, post your version and someone, chuckle-chicken-PZ, will provide feedback

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   木, 05/09/2019 - 01:16

I understand all your explanation and it's all good and sweet, but how you tie it together with( нос суют)

PinchusPinchus    木, 05/09/2019 - 01:10

Do you understand the word "светит" in this context? It's 1) like "shine" - sun shines 2) like "мне светит тюрьма" (I run/take risks to go to jail), "мне светит расстрел" (They can shoot me), "мне светят большие неприятности" (I can get into troubles). So, "светит медный таз" can be 1) sun shines 2) something glitters brightly and attract me 3) I can get into troubles 4) I can come and spoil evetything to everyone

silencedsilenced    木, 05/09/2019 - 04:11

Right, I get it now. I was missing the proper meaning of "светить". Thank you so much.

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   木, 05/09/2019 - 07:02

You forgot to mention: "Мне не светит", which means "I have no hope at all"

silencedsilenced    木, 05/09/2019 - 07:15

♪ Сережа, держись! Нам не светит с тобою, но козыри надо равнять. ♫ ;)

Treugol'nyTreugol'ny
   木, 05/09/2019 - 01:00

My mum also made the best jam in the world. The morello cherry one, was my favorite. My mum was originally from a small Ukrainian town(village) and what she could do with limited access to a diccent produce, was amazing. I will always miss her cooking.

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