Оборотень
LTWolfman
Richard Coombes
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 14:01
Why better? Shapeshifter is more precise. A werewolf is of course a shapeshifter.
St. Sol
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 14:13
Оборотень is an ancient Russian word referring specifically to a human capable of turning into a wolf during a full moon. Shapeshifter is a more modern word with sci-fi connotation and it has no direct equivalent in Russian (that's why Оборотень is used as a translation which is not entirely correct). Hope that helps.
Richard Coombes
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 14:45
Is the site playing up today, or is it me? I found this comment very interesting and wrote a reply, which I can't now see.
Richard Coombes
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 15:12
In essence, I said that my Kuznetsov monolingual Russian dictionary starts its entry for Оборотень with "человек, превращённый или способный превращаться с помощью колдовства в какого-л зверя или в какой-л предмет, and nowhere departs from this basic notion. Oxford English, for shape-shifter, refers simply to "mythology or science fiction". It's quite true that these two books date from 2000 and 2007 respectively, and may well have moved with the times. My first draft was called 'Werewolf', and it's true that the character in the song is a werewolf. But then I had another look and think, and felt that linguistics nudged me away from the specific "werewolf" towards something more general, and I also liked the way the title 'Shapeshifter' avoided some of the tacky associations that come with 'Werewolf.' When modern Russians hear the word 'оборотень', what springs to mind, I wonder ... You have encouraged me to do more research and to think more deeply. Thank you for taking the time to comment.
St. Sol
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 16:42
Re: When modern Russians hear the word 'оборотень', what springs to mind, I wonder...
I can't say for all Russians, but most likely modern Russians think of "оборотни в погонах" (werewolves in epaulets), meaning corrupt policemen, as well as politicians and such, as this topic is quite common in Russian movies and political discourse. The original "werewolf" meaning is mostly reserved for historical and folk art references.
Richard Coombes
Пн, 15/05/2017 - 15:27
I edited my comment while you were writing yours. You are right about the song and right about Skolot. It may be that I simply have a reluctance to use werewolf, because the first associations I get from the word are different from the atmosphere and focus of the song. This may simply be a personal thing, and it is also fair to say that 'Shapeshifter' may well strike other sections of a modern audience in the 'wrong' way, too. I need a word still current but whose associations have not been updated! Let me mull it over. Thank you again.
sandring
Втр, 16/05/2017 - 09:55
Dear gentlemen! I found your discussion extremely exciting, so I couldn't hold my candle and just look on. St.Sol, you're right saying that "Shapeshifter" sounds a bit sci-fi-ish with all that stupid "I'll be back!" and things. But there is an equivalent in Russian - it's a transformer, isn't it? On the other hand Richard has the point, too. "Werewolf" is so tacky that at once silly Hollywood oldies come to mind with fangs sticking out and the like. Of course, Richard can't do that to his favourite band. (Neither can I) And here I think the road forks. If you stick to the image of this particular song than the title might be "Wolfman" to discriminate between Slavic and Gothic. If you prefer to translate Оборотень as a notion, you, St.Sol, must remember Russian fairy-tales. Richard is right, оборотень is a person spelled into anybody or anything. Just remember Russian cartoons and animated films, trees coming alive, mushrooms turning into an old man etc. They are all оборотни (with no shoulder boards LOL). As for translating, I keep in mind it's Slavic, in Slavic mythology a person under spell didn't shift their shape, they dropped off their skin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhvycdfXpXY That's for Richard to enjoy! Anyway, Richard, there's another option you might consider "Turnskin" Have a good day, gentlemen! :)
Richard Coombes
Втр, 16/05/2017 - 10:09
Nadia - I was about to post "Would Wolf-Man do"? I thought of this overnight but hadn't got round to writing. I feel that at least I am going to move from Shapeshifter ...
Words and music by Aleksey Savenkov